Elementals, Engaging Characters, and the Beginnings of a Revolution with YA author Jamie Foley

Episode Transcript:

Introduction

CJ Milacci

Welcome my friend, you are listening to Read Clean YA with CJ, the podcast for teens and young adults who want to explore exciting worlds, deep themes, and epic stories without the objectionable content.

I’m your host, award-winning young adult author CJ Milacci, and in this episode we are going to dive into an author interview with my good friend and fellow young adult author, Jamie Foley.

Award-winning sci-fi fantasy author Jamie Foley loves strategy games, gardening, and making lembas bread. She’s terrified of red wasps and uses them for lightsaber training.

When not working as the Creative Director at Enclave Publishing, the typesetter for the Christian Writers Institute or a suspicious monarch at Fayette Press, she’s probably drawing maps to Carparelle. Her husband is her manly astronaut preacher muse. They live between the Texas hill country and the family cattle ranch, where their hyperactive Spawnling and Wolfpack roam. Jamie, welcome to the show!

Jamie Foley

Thank you so much. Oh my goodness, that author bio is just ridiculous. I was trying to like, okay, we have Lord of the Rings references and Star Wars and all the nerd stuff, everything I grew up on, you know.

CJ Milacci

Yes, I love it. I don’t think it’s bad. I think it’s fantastic. I love all of the different things that you wove in there. It’s so much fun. And also all of the hats you wear, which it’s just crazy that you do all of that. And you have these fantastic stories, which I am so excited to talk about today.

Jamie Foley

It is crazy, I don’t get much sleep, but thank you so much for having me on the show.

CJ Milacci

Yes, I’m excited. So today we’re going to talk about your Katrosi Revolution series and EmberHawk is the first book in this series. It has adventure, romance, magic, all of these incredible things in a world that is rich and nuanced and you just feel like you’ve entered into it. It’s such a great story. So I am excited to dive in and I would love if you could just tell us a little bit about this series without giving away too many spoilers.

Diving into the Katrosi Revolution Series

Jamie Foley

Okay, I’ll try not to give away spoilers, but Emberhawk is the first book. It’s gonna be one of four. I did Win an award for the second book in the series, which is very strange to me I always hate having like the slump book be the number two book And so I worked really hard on book as hard as on book two as I did on book one.

The series is very unique. It’s kind of like a clean version of Game of Thrones in that there’s a lot of politics going on, but there’s also romance and not everybody has to die. But it was inspired by me growing up with some Cherokee heritage and I was just fascinated by learning about the native tribes.

So in the book, there’s a tribal alliance, which some of the tribes belong to and some do not. One of the characters is trying to figure out how to get all these people to join together to fight against a common enemy, despite many differences in culture. And some are peaceful, some are not. Some are neutral, depending on the day. So the idea is what would have happened in the American Revolution if some of the native tribes would have allied with the American settlers to fight off the British, except the Queen of England is a water elemental who thinks she’s a goddess. So it’s very wild, it’s out there y’all, but apparently people like it, I don’t know.

CJ Milacci

It is so much fun and Jamie just is really good at downplaying her very cool story. It is such a fun world. It really is and you just named all these really cool elements and I love the different tribes and the different like groups that you’ve created and given nods to and it’s so fun to see it all woven together. I had no idea it had that American Revolution kind of backstory in the planning out of the series. That’s so wild.

Jamie Foley

Well, I still have a lot more to write. I’m working on book three right now. And so the revolution part hasn’t really super happened until book four. Book one kind of focuses on who would be considered American settler. Her ancestors were from the island that is across the sea, the Sea of Bones. So she is kind of like a part of a cattle rancher family. And they’re on the border with one of the tribes.

And so the question is, are these settlers, how are they going to interact with the tribes? Are they going to ally with their ancestors from across the island? Or do we maybe not like the people from the island because they tax us and they draft our sons and don’t really help us that much. So when she accidentally shoots one of the tribesmen who’s a scout in the first chapter, that’s when everything kind of blows up.

CJ Milacci

And it is so fun to see it all blow up because the world is cool from the very beginning, but then the things that she gets to explore and see and kind of crossing this line that she’s not supposed to cross into this other land. And all the things that she experiences there and this guy that she really wants to hate but can’t keep hating. It’s so much fun.

And as you’re describing it and I’m thinking of the American Revolution, I’m like, oh, I can see how that can definitely be a part of this.

Jamie Foley

Right? Well, it’s not that heavy. It’s very unique. That was just like the inspiration for the story. But I’ve heard people say in the reviews that it is very political, but that it doesn’t draw from any modern political issues. So it wouldn’t be like, you wouldn’t be able to draw any modern things about modern politics, because I don’t want that in my book. Like we’ve got enough stress from modern politics in everyday life. I’d like to escape to another world, please.

CJ Milacci

Yes. Yes, exactly. And this does that so well. And I think the political side of it adds that tension to the story because you kind of don’t know what’s going to happen next, who’s going to do what, is there going to be peace, is there going to be war? And it’s just this tumultuous undercurrent through the story and it adds that layer that keeps you turning the page to find out what happens next, which I love. I love a good page turner, so you’ve definitely accomplished that in the story.

Jamie Foley

Yay, I’m glad you think so. Since it’s my own work, it’s hard to, I’m very self-deprecating, you know, because I always wanna be doing it better and learning more and doing better and better with the next book. And right now I’m so focused on book three, I’m just like, okay, don’t say any spoilers.

CJ Milacci

Yeah, oh, I bet.

You have some really cool characters in this story, in this world. Is there one in particular that you really love that you’d say is your favorite? I know we’re not supposed to pick favorites, but still kind of feels like fun to do once in a while.

Let’s talk characters. Do you have a favorite?

Jamie Foley

Right! So the characters all live in my heart, so maybe it would be a betrayal for me to say that, but I can because I have one character who is the main character of book two, she’s this chieftess lady, and originally  when I concepted this story in high school, I’m way past high school, you guys, but this character, the chieftess, was a secondary character, and they say you’re never supposed to put yourself into a character. Although you can of course use your own traits and experiences, but like you’re never supposed to like become a character.

But it was a secondary or tertiary character in the original, which was just a very small book. And so I totally did that. And then when I started writing it as a professional writer, I was like, this can’t be me. I have to remove as much as I can from her, but I still feel like a lot like her

So she’s very easy for me to write and she struggles with a lot of things and lessons that I have learned personally in my life. So I love her.

Her name is Brooke and she has had a lot of bad luck so she is cursed but not really. And they call her the Jade Witch because they’re like oh she has this magic that we don’t understand and so we don’t like her. And so she has to learn to kind of live while being a leader but also loving her people even as they reject her a little bit.

So that’s a lot of fun.

But I also can’t not mention the other main character in book two, who is Lysander. So he’s not really an elf, but he does have his ears cut that way because he has lost his hearing in a tragic situation that you’ll learn about if you read the book. But he learns that Brooke’s magic is to be able to hear people’s thoughts and to speak into their minds, which is why she’s called a witch and she’s scary because she can read your thoughts.

And Lysander realizes through a situation that I won’t reveal that he could learn from her and learn to hear again people’s thoughts because he has lost his actual physical hearing. So there’s a romance between the two of them, but it kind of is, it kind of isn’t.

That’s book two, and I love both of them because Lysander is, he’s close to me because I had a, there was a student that I grew up with who was hard of hearing, and I saw him, the emotional toll that it took on him, not being able to clearly and quickly communicate with others around him.

And so I kind of based Lysander off of him. And so, and I have, thankfully, one of our mutual friends is an ASL interpreter, so she helped me a lot in keeping it realistic for this book.

CJ Milacci

I haven’t read book two yet. This is on my very high, on my next to read list because I loved book one, EmberHawk. So I’m excited because these characters get introduced in book one, but there’s so much more to discover about them and so much is hinted at. And I’m excited to dive into their story, which is an award-winning book. And that is so exciting as well.

Jamie Foley

I don’t know how that happened.

CJ Milacci

Hey, you know, it’s because promotion comes the Lord and so we just trust that you did the faithful thing and you wrote a great story and now many people have enjoyed it so it’s so good.

Jamie Foley

Well, thank you. I can’t question the Lord, so maybe I’ll just stop arguing on that point.

CJ Milacci

Yes, yes there you go exactly there we go!

Are there any tropes or things that you think people would love if they love this kind of story they would your series specifically, or this trope is kind of something in the book or something like that?

Who will love the Katrosi Revolution Series?

Jamie Foley

Well, oh my goodness, it’s difficult because the first book very much feels like a YA, right? And it all, and it’s YA in book two as well, but it kind of gets more mature as the characters get more mature and go through more difficult things. So it’s not that it’s adult in the end, but it’s almost like a Harry Potter in that transition, you know, where you start with the characters being younger and it gets darker thereon.

But not in like, there’s no wizarding school or anything like that. It would just mean like in the transition of the story. Like I mentioned before, it could feel similar to Game of Thrones just because it’s very political, but there’s a strong romantic thread and I’m not killing people willy-nilly.

There’s a Lord of the Rings element to it too. It’s like we have to save the world, and there’s an adventure with multiple characters.

So if you put like a YA romance inside of a Lord of the Rings, that’s probably what you get.

CJ Milacci

Yes, and I’m sure there are so many people like, yes, that is the book I’ve been waiting for. So thank you for that little description, that’s perfect.

One of the things I love to do with author guests is talk about the deeper theme in the story. So I would love  for you to share what’s like a theme in your book, maybe that is really close to your heart or something that you’re passionate about that got woven into the story accidentally or on purpose.

What can a story teach us about biblical gender roles?

Jamie Foley

Well, it might be a little controversial because I am a religious person, I’m a Christian and I love the Lord. And so I’m writing this series and all of my books really for teenage girls or for people who are hurting, who are feeling like they might be alone or like especially during COVID. Like I wrote Silver Blood during COVID. And so everyone felt alone, you know, even trapped in our own little homes.

So what I wanted to do was connect to the heart of these readers and give them hope and make them feel like they’re not alone because the characters can be experiencing something similar to what they’re going through. So when I was a kid, there was no Christian sci-fi or fantasy. It was like Chronicles of Narnia, Lord of the Rings, Frank Peretti and Ted Decker and like maybe Kathy Tyers. And that was like it. It was just not a thing.

And so I was not allowed to read anything except those that I had previously mentioned. And so I felt like there was nobody out there like me. There was nobody who loved Jesus and also dragons and lightsabers. I could read some Star Wars stuff too, but you know.

So some of the themes that I am trying to also weave into my books is biblical truth. So because I feel like that is where hope and light abides. And something that has really been under attack in our culture is gender roles and like what is a man? What is a woman? What are we supposed to do? And are there things that can make us happy? Like if we follow certain guidelines, but also someone very strange like me, I’m not your average girl over here. Do I belong?

Because when I was growing up, I was a serious tomboy. Like, serious, serious tomboy. And so I was struggling with my own identity even before it was a big cultural issue. And so what I’m trying to do with this series is that my main character, Kira, who’s the rancher girl, she is like a tinkerer, you know? And she hasn’t gotten married yet because she’s got an attitude and boys aren’t good enough for her because she’s so smart, you know? And she doesn’t wanna like be stuck in the kitchen cooking all day. And so I’m like, is there a place for her in the biblical view of womanhood?

And like my dude Ryan, he’s also the main character in book one and he is, he’s definitely manly, okay, but like he’s got a lot of feelings and he really cares for children specifically. And so , is it okay for him to have feelings and still be in the biblical view of manhood. With my chieftess character, she’s a leader. Is she allowed to be a leader? Is that okay?

But that takes a toll on her and all the stresses that she’s going through as a woman at the same time. And then Lysander is an alchemist, so he likes to grow plants and you know, which is not, there’s nothing like too feminine about that okay, but most of the times I think we associate an herbalist with a grandma or something, which is like my personal goal.

So anyway, I’m trying to show that we don’t have to be set in a cookie cutter mold and that the gender roles can be healthy for us without stuffing a square peg into a round hole. Does that make any sense?

CJ Milacci

Wow, definitely. Yes, and I love what you’re doing there because it is so confusing in our culture. And I’m sure for many listeners and readers, this is an issue that they’re trying to sort through themselves.

One of the things I love about stories is that it can take an issue and can teach us something subtly and almost just carefully as we dig into it we start to grow with the character and learn with the character and experience that transformation that they have through the story of discovering something about themselves that was always true, but maybe they  didn’t understand or didn’t know like their like biblical roles of men and women and how God made us unique and on purpose for a purpose, and that it doesn’t look the same for everybody but that doesn’t mean we don’t fit within God’s plan and even though maybe that’s not all exactly stated we can walk with these characters and watch them come into who they were meant to be and start to understand that truth in a deeper way which I think is a really powerful truth that in this there is a purpose for men, there is a purpose for women, there’s a biblical mandate for that, but also within that we don’t have to have that, like you said, cookie cutter mold, because I think it’s so easy to assume, well, if there’s a purpose, then that means it has to be a certain way and it has to fit this mold. And that’s not true.

It’s really not like we’re all unique. We’re all individuals. God made us individually for a purpose to reflect a part of His character that no one else can reflect. And if you weren’t the tomboy who loved all of these different things, you wouldn’t be who you are today, writing stories, and doing all of the incredible things you do. And that would mean the world is missing out on Jamie. For each and every individual. Like if we’re not walking in who God’s made us to be, then the world misses out on all the gifts God would have us use in that specific, weird, quirky, funny, silly, whatever calling we might feel it is.

Jamie Foley

Yeah, and I really feel like I don’t have to preach to say that, I’ll leave that to my husband, he’s a preacher. But I don’t, like I never want it to appear overt or like I’m teaching a lesson. Write a good story and it’ll tell the lesson itself, like that without, subliminally, without you even realizing it. So I’m never pushing my beliefs in people’s faces because that’s the beauty of story, that’s the power we have as storytellers.

CJ Milacci

Yeah, which I love and I love that Jesus was so into parables that he did that so often and people didn’t understand all the time what he meant and he had to explain it to his own closest followers but yet I feel like I’m sure several years later some of those truths in those stories that people didn’t get in that moment came home to roost in their minds later and they were like, oh that’s what that meant and that was the bigger point of he wasn’t just talking about sowing seed, you know, there was a bigger picture here.

And I think that’s one of the coolest things about stories is we don’t even realize sometimes  what they’re teaching us. Which is why it’s so important to be putting in stories that come from that a good worldview a biblical worldview even if it’s not an overtly Christian story still knowing that the truths within it are Pointing us in the right direction

Jamie Foley

Absolutely, and as someone with a rambunctious daughter, I have learned that just having the guidelines of truth around her and on our lives, our boundaries, makes her feel secure. So like in the world that doesn’t even believe in truth, for the most part, even just going into a world in a book where there is truth and there is that definition can speak directly to someone’s heart and give them comfort and maybe give them an escape from a bad situation that they’re going through.

CJ Milacci

Yes.

Yeah, and I think we need that escape sometimes in our difficult seasons of life, to be able to jump into the pages of a story and get lost there. Like you said, it’s not the politics of today that you deal with in your story, because you don’t want to be in a story dealing with the politics of today. That’s no fun. But it is just a fun, exciting world to enter. And the bonus is, as we read stories that are from that strong perspective, that foundation we have with a biblical worldview, they can teach us still which is so cool.

Jamie Foley

Agreed.

CJ Milacci

We’ll shift on to a little bit about you, a peek behind the curtain of the author behind these awesome stories, Jamie. So I know this is fun. This is so that readers can hear not just about your story, which is fantastic and you should go read, but I think sometimes knowing the author gets me more excited to read the story as well. So we’re gonna dive into you a little bit.

What started you on your writing journey?

Jamie Foley

Oh my gosh. Okay. Well, it’s an embarrassing story. So I have had story within me from the very beginning of my life. In preschool, I won Miss Pretty’s Pre-K Storyteller Award. I have no idea if that was for me telling stories in pre-k or me lying artfully. I don’t know. But that was my first writing award.

I know, so like I’ve always had stories in me, but I never had any confidence that I could write them. So, because like I didn’t do very super good in English in school. I mean, I did, but like I didn’t super enjoy that, you know? And only much later did I realize that being a writer and being a creative is about your creativity and your spark and telling the story. And that’s why we hire editors to help us with the English thing.

But I never pursued it for that reason, but I loved it so much that I was blessed enough to have an opportunity to work for Thomas Nelson out of college. And so I was working for a Christian publisher, helping to publish and market Christian stories. But they weren’t sci-fi. They weren’t fantasy. They weren’t YA. You know, they were, you know, the more the mainstream Christian stuff.

And I this is so strange. Okay, I don’t this has only happened to me once in my life But I felt strongly that God was telling me after three years there Then I needed to quit and to start writing my own stuff and I was like, you know what God? I don’t know if you know this but I work for a Christian publisher and books don’t make as much money as they used to because people are now watching Netflix and playing video games more than they did in the 90s.

And also God, I’m not knowing if you know this but I happen to know that there’s no like publisher publishing Christian sci-fi and fantasy at that time. And so I was just like, what was I gonna do? And I was the breadwinner in our family at the time.

So it’s like, what am I gonna do? Quit my job to start doing something I’ve never done before that I have no experience or confidence in to make no money and I guess self publish. And he kind of, God kind of like tortured me and beat me over the head with a two by four for six months until I actually obeyed.

I know, and then I wrote my first series, the Sentinel Trilogy, and I kind of didn’t do a very good job because I didn’t know what I was doing. And so I wasn’t like investing in it as a career. I wasn’t paying for professional editing. I just kind of like doot, doot, doot. And just did it. And then it came out there, and then people actually liked it, and people were actually giving me good reviews on it. And I was like, oh no, I actually do have…maybe talent that God has given me, and maybe I should have done it the right way and actually trained it.

So I took the whole series down, got professional editing, started going to conferences, and rewrote the entire trilogy. Yeah, I got new covers and everything and started actually listening. So I’m a very disobedient child. And that’s how my writing journey got started.

CJ Milacci

Wow, that’s fascinating. Jamie and I have been friends for about a year now and I did not know this story, so this is fun getting a little peek behind the curtain here.

Jamie Foley

It’s a little embarrassing.

CJ Milacci

I feel like some of the biggest decisions in our life often come with a bit of embarrassing stories, at least my biggest decisions. You know, me assuming that, of course, I know better than what God is telling me to do in this moment, and I should not be doing that, you know. And then he has to show me how wrong I am. So I  try to get better at that as I get older. And my recommendation is always to follow God’s leading, as he calls you.

Jamie Foley

Yes, I should have done that. Also, if y’all have seen the new movie Sound of Freedom that came out, there’s a line in that movie that says, “‘When God tells you what to do, you cannot hesitate.'” And I would highly recommend following that advice.

CJ Milacci

Yes, that is powerful and that will definitely bring you to some crazy places in life, but with the Lord, the craziest places are the safest places to be.

Now that you have been writing for several years, have you ever been in a really random place and gotten a story idea or just kind of have any of your stories been birthed in just unique environments or settings?

Where are you most inspired to write?

Jamie Foley

That happens all the time. And yeah, I was like, this probably, you probably know the answer to this as a writer yourself. But yeah, I get crazy random ideas that pop into my head all the time. And most of them are not worthy of writing, but I could acknowledge that when I see it, something inspiration in nature or in a different book or a different TV show or video game or whatever it is, if I see something that is exciting to me that I really like, I can at least latch onto that idea and write it down later, and then have a list of elements that are exciting to me, because as writers, we have to be passionate about our own work. I can’t just crank stuff out just because… it’s not like that to me. I have to be passionate about it. And so I have cannibalized a lot of old story ideas and put them together with other new ideas, and that’s kind of what I’m working on with my upcoming series right now.

CJ Milacci

Wow, so exciting. Well, once that series is ready to be talked about, we’ll have to have you back on so we can chat about that series too.

Jamie Foley

I would love to, I would love to, but yeah, my favorite place to write is like a balcony somewhere with a great view. And it doesn’t matter what the view is, but one of my favorite places, okay, this is, I’m gonna take the conversation in a little bit of a strange way, okay? Everything’s okay, but my town is currently on fire. Because I know, I know, okay. So I live in Bastrop County in Texas, and it was known for the worst wildfire in Texas history.

And fires just happen here all the time. So if you go to Bastrop State Park in Texas, you will see tons of trees like jagged burned trees, fallen over trees, all kinds of problems that have scarred the landscape, but you also see new growth. And so to me, that’s very attractive as a writer because there is a story within the landscape itself of disaster and recovery.

So any place that I can go that will adventure, you know, and tell, what is the story of that landscape? If I can get a balcony, I will absolutely sit there and write probably at like 2 a.m. because that’s when everybody else is asleep.

CJ Milacci

I can’t write at 2 a.m. I am definitely an early to bed kind of girl, but I love that is an inspiring time for you.

Jamie Foley

It’s the only time when it’s quiet, you know, around here.

CJ Milacci

Yes, oh, yes, well, it looks like we’re running to the end of our time here. I would love for you to tell readers where they can find you and your book and all the things about you.

Where Can Readers Find Jamie Foley?

Jamie Foley

Oh, okay. Well, my website is jamiefoley.com because I do so many different things. You’re gonna have to click on my writing or my books tab to actually see my books because I also work for Enclave Publishing and do a bunch of other stuff for like Fayette Press and typesetting and I draw maps and all kinds of ridiculous digital art things. But I’m on Amazon under Jamie Foley and I think my books are generally available wherever books are sold.

CJ Milacci

Wonderful, and I’ll have links to everything in the show notes as well, so it’s easy for you to grab them if this sounds like a great series for you, and I can guarantee you will love the story building and the world building and the story and all of the fun elements within it. So, Jamie, thank you for being on Read Clean YA with CJ. It was so fun having you.

Jamie Foley

Thank you so much CJ, it was great.

Wrapping things Up

I hope you enjoyed the conversation with Jamie Foley. As she said herself, Jamie can be self-deprecating since she’s always looking to grow and improve, but the Bible says to let another’s lips praise you, so I’m here to tell you that Jamie is an incredible story-teller. If you’re looking for an engaging world, fascinating fantasy elements, and relatable characters, then this series is for you.

Don’t Forget The October Goodies Giveaway!

Jamie Foley has also graciously agreed to include a copy of Emberhawk, book one in her series, along with some very fun swag, in this month’s giveaway, so don’t forget to check out the October Giveaway for Read Clean YA with CJ and find her book along with some other great Young Adult books.

You can find the episode show notes at readcleanya.com.

Coming Next Week

Next week I’ll be talking with YA author Sandra Fernandez Rhoads, author of The Colliding Line Series. When worlds Collide, shadows wrestle light. This contemporary fantasy duology is fantastic, and I so enjoyed my conversation with Sandra and can’t wait to share it with you. These books are great fall reads, so I hope you tune in to hear about the stories and discover a new adventure this fall.

Thank you so much for listening to Read Clean YA with CJ. If you enjoyed this episode, please share it with a friend so they can discover exciting, clean young adult books too.